Juniper Mist Wireless Updates and Innovations with Wes Purvis

0:10 hello everyone I am West pervis I do wireless things at mist and uh this is the wireless portion of our Mobility

0:16 Field Day presentation so uh I would be remiss if

0:22 I did not talk about Wi-Fi 7 uh since that is the uh current hotness in in our

0:28 industry uh and of of course I think everybody is familiar with this number

0:34 46 uh gigabit per second right this is this is the speed that you can expect on

0:39 Wi-Fi 7 um with a 320 MHz wide channel right

0:45 that's 16 bonded channels right it's uh a very wide Highway you have uh 4K quam

0:54 which um yeah uh so uh

1:00 I mean you know all jokes aside I mean think about this number though think about the beginnings of Wi-Fi and to the

1:06 point where we are now I mean this is seriously impressive it's actually pretty cool um but if you if you break

1:14 down you know that that number right that 46 gbit per second right that is 16

1:19 spatial streams at 320 MHz wide channels so uh I think most of the

1:29 people in this room and most of the people watching will not be able to deploy that uh because we're expecting

1:35 most Enterprise APS will not be 16 spatial streams uh there will be no missed 16 spatial stream Wi-Fi 7 AP I uh

1:43 you know regret to inform you uh but um yeah so let's let's think about okay

1:49 what is actually more realistic so from from a Wi-Fi 7 Enterprise AP perspective

1:55 we're expecting you know that aggregate data rate on the AP to be 26 GB per

2:01 second which is not quite 46 but it's still like a really big number it's a lot more than 11 megabits per

2:07 second so but okay that that's like you know across all the radio so what is the

2:14 actual kind of realistic expectation of Wi-Fi 7 so if we assume

2:20 our clients are two special stream which they have been for you know since mostly 11 AC um but definitely 11 ax so two

2:29 spatial stream at M13 right so that's the that's the 4K quam rate the evm for

2:36 that is ne40 uh so you better be right uh you know right by that AP um but

2:43 assuming you can get that M13 right so at 80 megahertz single client data rate

2:49 of uh you know almost 1500 or 1.5 gig right 40 MHz 688 megabits per second 20

2:56 MHz 344 megabits per second data rate right that's the the data rate and of course we all know that you know actual

3:03 throughput because of Wi-Fi overhead will be you know about half or 60% maybe a little bit higher if you're in good

3:08 conditions um but this is the more realistic expectation you you could see

3:14 a modest speed bump of single client performance uh with Wi-Fi 7 right just

3:21 just by you know if you if you're just looking at that data rate number now there are other features in Wi-Fi 7

3:27 which we're excited about like uh like mllo like static puncturing like um some

3:34 of the enhancements to multi-resource unit uh usage and these are things that

3:40 we're not quite sure how they will how well they will actually work right and so uh some of the things like mllo have

3:47 actually looked um you know uh encouraging in the lab but that's the lab so uh if you know if you think back

3:54 to the previous generations of Wi-Fi like let's go to 11ac with multiuser myo

3:59 multiuser myo also looked really promising in the lab in fact if you go

4:05 uh search on the internet you will find a video of me doing a lab test with multiuser myo and it looking really good

4:10 with a video stream test but once you got into the real world some of the overhead and it just it just never

4:17 really worked all that well on the other hand with Wi-Fi 6 you have ofdma ofdma

4:22 has actually been solid right especially down link ofdma it happens all the time

4:27 Uplink is a little you know still a little bit uh tougher to to schedule but you will see it um so you know we're

4:34 we're hoping that mllo will Trend more like ofdma but we're not there yet right we don't um you know and we won't know

4:42 that until there's um you know more you know production deployments with um you

4:47 know with clients uh and so this will take a little bit of time to vet out and so for us the way that we think about

4:54 things is is is Wi-Fi 6 is or sorry 6 GHz Wi-Fi um and and so where are we

5:01 with 6 GHz Wi-Fi well uh in the past few months we have seen a large uptick in in

5:08 in adoption when I say large we've gone from let's say 10% um in in many

5:15 environments to some environments where we're now seeing 20 to 30% 6 gig

5:20 adoption so here's just a couple screenshots um that I grabbed of okay

5:25 this particular customer in this you know in this site has almost 18,000 clients

5:31 almost 4,000 of those clients are on six gig right that's that's really cool to me it's it's cool to see um how things

5:38 have increased right if if we think about Wi-Fi six clients it took probably

5:43 four years to get a meaningful client adoption so we we're still on that Journey with 6 gz clients um but we're

5:51 we're in the middle of that Journey uh here's a small site uh 65 clients but 12

5:57 right the 12 on 6 GHz and here's another one with you know 3500 clients and and

6:02 over a thousand of them on six G so this you know this is this is real life right

6:08 this is 6 GHz is here it's working um and and we're starting to see clients I

6:14 mean we're even at the point where you know in the US we have 1200 MHz of spectrum uh and we've kind of defaulted

6:21 to 80 MHz channels in some cases we're thinking should we go down to 40s in Europe where we have 500 MHz of spectrum

6:28 we kind of you know we usually 40s we're thinking should we go down to 20s so uh

6:33 that that adoption is you know is is something that we're seeing um and definitely really excited about like I

6:40 was even in my local grocery store of all things you know uh and you know I

6:45 look you know on my phone and oh I'm on six gig right this was a it's an ow SSID

6:51 ow transition right this is just I don't know six gig is happening it's all around us um the point is the the

6:58 technology has matured right um over the you know last year and past few years it's okay what's it going to be like

7:05 right this is kind of we're on that same Journey with Wi-Fi 7 and we'll get there we'll get to maturity it just we're

7:11 there now with 6 GHz you gra the right I did I did have to

7:19 check um uh and you know here's another example where um you know on some of

7:25 these APS there's actually more six gig clients than there are five gig clients on that AP right so here this top one 45

7:32 clients on 6 gig 41 clients on 5 gig so this is why you know that that 20 MHz 40

7:38 MHz 80 MHz Channel width you know discussion becomes more relevant

7:43 kind from uh so for this particular example um it was predominantly

7:49 smartphones smartphones um uh Apple and Android but uh you know in some of our

7:55 other customers um you know it's it's the it's the laptops that are causing the the

8:02 adoption so uh that brings to the next topic which is uh automated frequency

8:08 coordination which is related to 6 GHz Wi-Fi so uh as probably most uh are

8:15 familiar uh as we basically any six gz deployment out there today is in the low

8:22 power mode low power indoor which means you have to deploy indoors at a low power uh there is another mode of

8:29 operation called standard power and standard power um requires the use of a

8:34 frequency coordination system and the FCC as of uh end of February um has has

8:42 approved um several AFC providers uh and so standard power AFC is open for

8:49 business now there are special requirements that go along with that that I'll talk a little bit about um and

8:54 from a client perspective the client has to be certified to connect to a standard

8:59 power access point so uh and there's there's basically two three types of clients but two that we'll see most

9:06 commonly one is a low power only client which means I will only connect to a low power AP then there's also the standard

9:13 uh or dual client that dual client uh that dual client um can connect to um

9:23 both a low power and a standard power AP and what we saw what we've seen is the

9:28 initial client were low power clients and um now most clients that are certifying are certifying as dual and

9:35 some client vendors are going back and and do and recertifying um but not

9:40 everybody so you the thought is you'll have pretty good client support um but may not have

9:47 every every client support uh in in standard power mode um well since uh

9:52 this is relatively new end of uh February uh all of the six gig clients

9:58 out there is that a software firmware update or is that something that is just going to be not compatible yeah so from

10:05 a from a client device right the client device needs to be certified to connect to the standard power AP and so uh

10:12 clients have been able to certify as as standard power duel since since 6 gz was

10:17 approved in the US so there are many clients out there already that are certified as duel some are going back

10:23 and recertifying um once they're certified they can do a software update to uh connect to a standard power

10:31 now our customers engaging Juniper to report um Energy Efficiency metrics with

10:38 the implementation of the standard client is that something that's on the road map is that you know being uh

10:44 discussed when you say Energy Efficiency you mean like the power on the phone yes uh as well as power on the AP itself uh

10:53 overall you know yeah so when I say low power and standard power the the actual power consumption of the AP is not all

11:00 that different right there's there's different allowed RF transfer power um but you know the the several DB of

11:08 transer power it's it's not all that much in terms of actual wattage like you know consumption on the AP all

11:16 right okay so how do you determine or how does a client determine if they're connecting to a low power AP or standard

11:22 power AP well you look in the beacon the beacon has a regulatory info bit uh zero

11:27 means indoor low power indoor A1 means standard power you may also see a four

11:33 um but the client uses that to determine do they connect can they connect to that AP there's also a transmit power element

11:40 IE in the beacon that tells the client what transmit Powers it's able to use and that's especially relevant for

11:47 standard power where the allowed transer power may be

11:52 dynamic so why do we have an AFC well it's because 6 GHz was previously and remains

12:01 a a licensed spectrum and so extensive studies were performed to say indoors in

12:07 the low power mode there's no uh possibility of interference right you're not going to interfere with the

12:13 incumbents and the incumbents are typically fixed microwave links um you know Point topoint service some of the

12:19 um uh you know local TV news stations the the TV van that can be uh in six GHz

12:26 Bann um but in outdoor usage there is concern around interference and and you

12:32 know probably rightly so and so that's where the frequency coordination service comes in is to say you know based on

12:38 your your location I'm going to look in this database there's a database of all these licensed uh users of the location

12:46 the antenna pattern and you know the the transfer power they're allowed and all that stuff so combine the you know the

12:52 AP location the Wi-Fi AP with the incumbent location and you know run some

12:57 formulas to say all right you can use these channels you can't use these channels you have to pull back power a little bit you know so that's why we

13:04 have a frequency coordination service in 6 gig um if you go on the FCC website there's the universal licensing system

13:12 that you can actually go search you know in your local area you know what's around you can see all the links if it's

13:17 point it's this one's a point to multi-point uh what frequency they're operating in and and so the the AFC

13:24 system has been standardized um thanks to the work you know from from Wi-Fi by Alliance and wi forum and and so

13:31 generally the pieces of the puzzle you have the access point you have the AFC

13:38 system and then you have the um the licensed databases the FCC databases uh

13:44 so the AP talks to the AFC provider the AFC provider has the the FCC database

13:51 information and has the formulas and those formulas are you know are defined by the FCC of the calculations that need

13:58 to be performed so the AP is sending you know location information um and and

14:03 typically in most Enterprise deployments there'll actually be a proxy in the middle so the aps aren't necessarily

14:09 talking directly to the AFC system um and you know like in the case of mist uh our cloud is actually is acting as the

14:15 proxy um to to communicate the um AFC information so we don't have to open up

14:21 any new ports on the firewall have to do any that y so so from from the AP what

14:27 are the requirements that you know the AP needs to follow because ultimately it's the AP that's

14:33 that needs to comply right so first of all the AP needs to have an AFC update

14:38 every single day every 24 hours now if I don't get an update in 24 hours I'm

14:43 allowed to continue using my 6 gig Channel until 11:59 of the following day

14:49 so I don't have to cut off right away um let's say you know I for whatever reason I lose connectivity um to you know Miss

14:57 cloud or you know by extension the AFC provider um so yeah if my 24 hours

15:03 expires I have until uh the end of the next day when I have to shut off uh I need to provide my geolocation

15:11 that geolocation has to be determined automatically it cannot be manually inputed so uh most commonly this will

15:17 use a uh a gns or GPS receiver within the access point itself um or it could

15:24 um uh not necessarily every access point has to have that uh receiver you could

15:29 kind of pool you know if you know APS are deployed in a similar area you also have to report an uncertain uncertainty

15:35 area which is um how you know I I think I'm in this location plus or minus 20

15:42 MERS or plus or minus 5 MERS right that's your 90% confidence you need to provide your height above ground level

15:48 you have to provide a unique device identifier which is you know typically serial number um and you also have to um

15:55 provide uh or if if you if the AP has lost power it needs to either rovide new

16:03 location coordinates or say I have not actually moved right it needs to be able to make that determination so for this

16:10 uncertainty value in um in step two what is there a maximum uncertainty value can

16:15 I can I say hey this is what I expect with an uncertainty of a thousand miles

16:20 and boom I've cleared the entire state or something like you can right you can you can do that but you but you'll

16:25 likely get all the AFC incumbents and everything might have a lot of restricted channeling okay for does

16:33 the uh operator the network admin have to put in these details or will the AP

16:38 automatically have some device thats all this so GP the geolocation is automatic

16:44 um the only one that you could enter is the height above ground level um and so um you know depending on how the AP is

16:52 deployed right there's a um like so you know some of the aps have a barometer

16:57 that can determine height um but you could you could also enter it in certainty value based upon anything

17:03 other than what the person that's putting it in it's not tied no no nobody is entering that that is that

17:10 is automatically kind of like a client Jo algorithm like it's inherent to so so like as we as GPS location okay like as

17:18 we're going through our um our regulatory approvals we actually have to go to an FCC lab and test the the GPS

17:25 chip that's in RP in a variety of locations we actually have to go to multiple locations um so the GPS chip

17:32 has that uncertainty value corre into it okay right see well I was tagging on those questions so CPI certification was

17:38 a big deal a couple years ago for all the stuff that happened in cbrs is there no certification process there's nothing

17:45 because the geolocation is automatically determined there's no um yeah CPI or

17:51 professional installer requirement that's the difference that makes this different than SAS is that that requirement is not right that you don't

17:57 have to manually put stuff in it's a blessing and a curse I got a question from uh from

18:03 German uh can can a bad third party actor trick the GPS system so much that it can force s SP

18:10 offline um potentially right I mean if you're jamming G if you're jamming GPS

18:16 you're going to cause a lot of problems for a lot of people um but yes inherently require it relies upon GPS

18:24 location okay so from a from a standard power client you know perspective like

18:30 the so the AP obviously can operate higher Transit power but the clients can also use higher Transit power so

18:36 initially there's some confusion around that there's a 6db offset right is that 6db below the ap's operating

18:44 level or the granted level and it's the granted level so it doesn't matter what

18:49 the AP is operating this the client can use 60b below whatever was granted So in theory the client can have higher

18:56 transer power in standard power mode than low power mode which um you know

19:02 should help in you know some deployment scenarios you're not seeing many standard only clients no okay glad to

19:09 hear that yep um so what does the Spectrum request look like well it looks like this and

19:15 it's all standardized um it you know basically providing serial number type of request my certification

19:21 ID what I'm requesting so my my location my uncertainty my height um you can

19:26 actually provide location as an ellipse um rather than just a single coordinate

19:31 and uh and then what frequencies and what operating classes the operating class is the bandwidth and so you know

19:39 we you know in Mist we request every operating class just so we have the full data set so do we actually care about AFC so

19:48 certain use cases yes so one outdoor you have to use it uh two is uh external

19:55 antennas field installed external antennas you have to do it and then there's actually

20:01 discussion do you care about AFC indoors like in a normal indoor deployment would

20:07 AFC would standard power mode on the AP actually benefit you the thought is

20:12 because of that higher client Transit power there could be some benefit so if we if we look across mist

20:19 and I showed this I showed this data at wlpc the average RSSI of every client

20:24 across mist of how the AP hears the client is 55 dbm that same value in in 6 GHz is 64 dbm

20:33 right so there's a 9db right these are all low power clients but what we've seen as we look at our zoom and teams

20:39 data as we look you know at our at our experience data this isn't terrible like all that relevant in most of our

20:46 deployments which are capacity based right so you have an adequate density if

20:51 you're in the main part of the cell right this is perfectly fine but if you

20:57 have a less dense deployment um or you're at The Fringe of the cell that's where this additional transer power for

21:04 standard power could help so we've done some

21:10 testing and we need to do a lot more testing right we're at the very beginning of of this kind of theory of

21:16 you know is standard power actually beneficial but this is a pixel 8 and there's about a 3db 2 to 3db difference

21:24 of how the AP hears the client when operating in standard power mode and low power mode so

21:32 3db I mean it's 3db but is it worth all of there's a lot of effort that goes

21:37 into AFC um you know with there's a lot of baggage let's say with the geolocation and you know especially

21:44 indoors populating you know GPS location so you know and this is just one client

21:51 right so you know at least my feeling is

21:56 indoor standard power is like is more of a niche use case than

22:02 an everyday use case right you may have scenarios where you you have less dense deployments right you have you know more

22:08 of a coverage deployment or you're worried about you know Fringe of the cell and that's where standard power can

22:13 help indoors um in addition to the two use cases that you have to do it work warehouses places like that not

22:19 necessarily coverage areas low density yeah I mean even even in like a warehouse where you like if you have

22:25 line of sight right many of our warehouse deployments um Warehouse antenna Point straight down a couple

22:31 antennas in the aisle right I have line of sight I I'm not think I don't need okay it's extender antenna so probably

22:37 they will but uh assuming it wasn't like I'm not envisioning standard power maybe I'm thinking like like cannabis grow

22:44 facilities sure you've got huge huge areas right and just very you've got sporadic devices everywhere but you're

22:50 going for more coverage than anything else so you need that extra 3db y cuz 3db I it's half power when you when you

22:56 say it um when you see standard power doors as being sort of a more Corner case scenario do you see any risks I

23:02 guess the biggest risk of just simply launching with standard power off in the first place is what client compatibility

23:08 client compatibility and so assuming the client compatibility hits a critical mass where that that's not an issue you

23:14 wouldn't really be heartbroken about recommending standard power across all

23:19 no I mean and you can deploy a dual band us S ID so you just fall back to five fall back to five yeah um or you know so

23:26 the other thing is you lose you know you can in Center power you have uni 5 un7 oh you lose channels yeah so you lose

23:32 some channels okay yeah but output power of the radio is not different it could be slightly higher because like dra's

23:37 point right if you if you're running standard power versus low power can you disable certain elements in the in the

23:44 access point to save energy I mean yeah so I mean there there's like a diminishing return there

23:50 it's like well you so the AP just just because AP is allowed to use the higher power it doesn't have to right and and

23:55 most of our deployments we're reducing power anyway anyway y okay so I'm getting the speed up from

24:02 Sadir um take notes so uh we're working on our

24:10 AFC uh approval um but I just want to give you a little preview of what goes kind of behind the scenes this is will

24:15 be our first AFC AP Center power AP ap64 which is our outdoor AP as built- in

24:21 GPS and it will support external antennas no in 16 spatial

24:26 streams and this is a um Wi-Fi 60 AP 60 okay okay so then I'm going to get to

24:32 the stuff that s actually wanted me to talk about so let's talk about redundancy and

24:40 uh deploying redundantly so Mist has had tools for

24:47 determining have you actually deployed redundantly so if you've ever seen Mist

24:52 uh this is a switch view that we have um in the switch tab you just go to

24:59 and the color of the AP indicates the switch that it's connected to so this

25:06 allows you to see you know do I have clusters of switches and I can turn on like you know a heat map and okay let's

25:11 say I lose uh my blue switch so I'm going to lose some coverage you know at the bottom part there um and this is

25:18 this has actually worked really well this works with juniper switches third party switches um doesn't matter this

25:24 has worked really well for us and and has helped um customers deploy like assault and pepper type deployment where

25:30 AP1 connected to switch one ap2 which is right next to it is connected to switch 2 um and this has worked this like I

25:38 said this worked really well um but it requires you to look at the map to verify and so what we're what we're

25:46 introducing is a redundancy View and uh uh so if you look the colors

25:54 have changed basically to uh green orange and red and what this actually um

26:02 what this actually means is if I'm if I'm red my top neighbor is connected to

26:07 the same switch if I'm orange I have at least one neighbor that's connected to a different switch if I'm green then I

26:13 have two neighbors connected to different switches and the point of this is yeah we're showing it on the map you

26:19 can visualize it but we're assigning a redundancy score to the site to the

26:24 switch to the AP so that you can pull this programmatically to identify your

26:29 sites or locations that that have the worst redundancy capabilities so we're

26:34 basically marrying our um our like the switch Uplink data that that we've had

26:41 with radio Resource Management data to actually determine from an RF perspective what is your redundancy if

26:47 you were to lose a switch and where this is really exciting is we're working on

26:52 uh you know some improvements for our switch upgrades and we will actually feed this data into our switch upgrades

26:59 to say if you've deployed redundantly I can reboot my switches in

27:04 such a way that I still have Wi-Fi coverage right so you can have uh you know a hitless Edge upgrade which uh

27:11 which is very very cool to me well so the switch will automatically determine which like if I have a stack of like

27:18 four switches and I have obviously APS connected orally so switches will automatically figure out which one I

27:23 should reboot the cloud will and the cloud cloud will sorry yeah so Cloud will tell them hey you should reboot vers okay oh that's

27:30 cool okay um yeah so this is uh yeah I

27:36 think you something we're we're excited about and uh you know we we've seen folks you know try to deploy redundantly

27:43 so here's one example of kind of a a not so great example but working with the best that you have um you know these APS

27:50 uh in the line right so like at the end when when I can hear other APS you know

27:55 they're Orange um but in the middle of the trust they red right so um you know because there's no right but this this

28:02 is a you know special case deployment here's an actual example uh of of it done well um so here is the the top is

28:11 the aps by switch so the different again the different colors represent different switches and so in this particular

28:17 example most of the aps are connected to different switches that are next to each other and the bottom is the redundancy

28:23 View and basically um everywhere is green so there's very high redundancy um

28:28 this guy on the bottom left if you look right this that's this yellow AP and you

28:33 know kind of these two are the same the same switch around it right so yes do you know if this this

28:42 customer thought about this before they this customer did yes they absolutely did because fixing it if you got a B one

28:50 might be a pretty expensive option what yeah so what we've seen is this is something you you're thinking about at

28:55 the time of deployment um and uh and the switch redundancy view

29:01 like the the redundancy score allows you to audit um have you done what you thought you've

29:07 done that seems like a lot of APS in that office space it's a big office it's bigger than it looks

29:15 okay but it could also be a dense deployment

29:20 um okay so let's talk a little bit about RF

29:25 troubleshooting in mist uh so in Mist we have uh several uh you

29:33 know capabilities of of you troubleshooting capacity and RF issues so the cap the capacity SLE in mist is

29:39 one such way and there's U if you can see there's classifiers here and these

29:45 classifiers will will figure out is it is it me that's tring like one of my clients uh is it because of the you know

29:52 number of clients has increased the usage has increased is it like a co- Channel neighbor um you know AP on on

29:58 the same channel or is it non- Wi-Fi interference right so we we bucke tize um and RRM actually uses this data to

30:05 make its determination um and same thing there's a you know Channel occupancy view so in

30:10 this case there's you know basically an interference Source this interference Source uh on 6

30:17 GHz uh Channel 5 actually between Channel 1 and channel 5 um and you know

30:25 what what we have seen is RM will actually Channel channelize around this um so often times our customers are not

30:30 actually aware that there's interference in the environment uh you know until they until they go track it

30:38 down what uh what I'm going to introduce now um is our Spectrum visibility so

30:47 uh you know first and foremost I'll just say mist is supporting manual like a manual Spectrum capture like you would

30:54 fully expect um but what I'm going to actually talk about here is is what we call Dynamic Spectrum

31:00 capture so this is the ability of let's say there's an interference source and

31:06 RRM changes its channel right we're we're avoiding it wouldn't it be cool to see yeah there's actually an interfere

31:12 and this is what it looked like that's what we're doing yes it would be cool before you get how here's

31:20 the question yeah uh so I mean the AP has a lot of metrics and knows it

31:26 actually it knows when there's interference right um and uh and so with that we will use a kind of a combination

31:34 of both AP level and Cloud assist um there will be different you know workflows um but uh to actually then

31:42 trigger Spectrum capture on the AP itself the hardware is capable and we have not yet enabled it but that's what

31:47 we're doing now is there is there an additional radio taking care of that or you disabling the Wi-Fi functionality so

31:53 you look at the Spectrum at that time no so every M AP has a in scanning radio

31:59 security radio we'll do the Spectrum captures from that dedicated radio what's the level of resolution uh currently it's uh

32:07 32.5 um uh ker but uh that this one is

32:12 actually we have some flexibility to tweak right so we're not going to win any awards with you know with resolution

32:19 ask but it's uh and this is been inside just waiting for the software to catch up to

32:25 Y stealthy so let me show what this does this does

32:31 this work on six gigahertz as well oh thank you for

32:37 asking so uh I have this I have this device here this is a pter video

32:44 transmitter it operates on 5 GHz it operates on 6 GHz it is a 6 GHz

32:51 interfer so there's a receiver that I have in my box of goodies um but I'm not going to turn it on uh

33:00 so uh earlier I've actually triggered you know I've turned this on and uh and

33:07 this is kind of how we intend things to look so oh I have a I have an RRM radio event here this AP changed channel from

33:15 uh Channel 5 to channel 21 it did it because of interference non Wi-Fi right

33:23 and here is a uh an fft this will change this will actually you know this is kind

33:28 of like a kid drawing right now um but this will this will look a lot nicer um but this is the intention right I want

33:34 to capture what this interference looks like so that you can go and look at it um and then we can start doing you know

33:41 a lot of cool things with this data once we have it classification classification yeah nobody I don't think anybody has

33:47 really done classification at least Wi-Fi vendor side well um so you know we're thinking about can we crowdsource

33:54 you know that it's it trouble ticket suppression to like let the people at the help desk know if you get a call

34:00 don't freak out correct we saw a thing y it's baby monitor Yep this this also been Marv actions also right yeah this

34:06 will come into Marv actions yep cool yeah so that's uh uh this is

34:14 you know the thing that I'm most excited about uh today um we've put a lot of effort into it we still have some effort

34:19 left um full disclosure this won't be available immediately um but this is this is the idea um we

34:29 we're we're we're actually capturing you know a couple seconds of the spectrum capture so we can we can enhance the you

34:36 know the graph that you see here to put in density type of data um we could also potentially do like a video or gift um

34:44 but uh yeah there's there's a lot of potential for this um and I'm yeah I'm really excited would customers be able

34:51 to label their own interference so I've got a conference center I know the AV

34:57 crap steps on my stuff all day can I just label that waveform this is Av crap

35:04 yep that's that's what so that's one of the things that we're thinking about is to let customers label their own uh interference right because one of the

35:11 things that one of the tough things about classification is is keeping updated on on the interference forces

35:16 right everything says video camera or microwave microwave tdd uh where

35:22 lightning sensor once the signatures are uh recorded in a location is this

35:28 beneficial just for that location or will this benefit like other customers outside of that organization so those

35:35 are things that we're still working through um we we can we can do our kind of classification labeling in two ways

35:40 right we can keep it customer specific and some customers may want that um but we can also use it as a crowd Source

35:46 where we're building our um you know classification stuff this is from AAP yes how do you

35:55 handle a lot of interferers would would would have a larger blast radius yes

36:00 could you use this with your Mist Cloud to not triangulate at least give you a

36:07 who sees it worse correct yeah so yes that is that's the intention we want to get to kind of a point where we can try

36:14 to put this on a map um uh and we can use the scan radio like we're using the

36:19 scan radio and the reason we're detecting is because that particular AP has been interfered with but then we can

36:26 from the cloud we can trigger other AP

36:31 U question are you able to connect with any third party tools to to look at this like Wi-Fi Explorer or something so we

36:38 have we we have been in talks with some of the tool vendors around exposing this data to them especially in the um well

36:46 the dynamic piece as well as when we get to the manual piece um you know both of those uh to expose those in third party

36:51 tools but nothing to announce at this point if multiple APS see the same interfere do you get multiple events or

36:58 do you correlate those and just report once so in this partic what this particular view um it will be AP by AP

37:07 um but the intention is then when we bubble up into Marv's actions it would it would be Consolidated and then you can triangulate where that interfer is

37:13 coming from can I hang it around my neck and walk around and do a site survey

37:18 with what um any need chance to be able to do like on demand or something like

37:23 that um if somebody wants to just just like marvus minis right you can do like a manual test or something like that yes

37:30 is there something like that yeah correct I'm not showing it here but yes okay yes

37:35 cool okay um so then

37:42 um so a few a few more things um from a from Marvis action standpoint uh we're

37:47 introducing a couple new Marvis actions one is a traffic Loop Marvis action so

37:53 this is combining the AP reflection data that we've had for a long time so if any of you are missed users you may have

37:59 seen AP reflection that's the AP hearing its own frames um and we can marry that with or without switch data um to to

38:07 provide a a um a a switch um you know an

38:13 AP you know Loop detected um and then second is when when APS disconnect from

38:19 Mist uh we usually get a customer ticket and that customer ticket is hey are you having an

38:25 issue uh especially it's a large outage and a large customer um but most of the

38:31 time not all the time most of the time uh it's it's an ISP issue and so we will do ISP correlation

38:40 automatically we're actually already doing this internally but we're going to expose this as part of the AP offline Marvis action this is an ISP issue and

38:46 this is the ISP that was causing your problem and this is particularly relevant for you know our larger customers who have many many you know

38:52 sites for locations so from a uh just to kind of give give a little bit of a demo um here

38:59 is the AP Loop detected um and this is the switch that the AP is connected to right um to say

39:06 Yep this is this is where the um you know this is where you need to look um

39:12 you know for that Loop and then uh the MSP or the ISP

39:18 view uh so if you see kind of down here there's this 16 APS in this site went

39:25 offline due to ISP issue and uh I

39:33 froze awesome question about your loot detection yep it does it replace the AP

39:41 reflection or so just like all of our alerts you have um some of the let's

39:47 call them the unfiltered alerts uh and then those go into marva's actions that's that's the kind of higher

39:52 efficacy so it doesn't replace the existing um but it's a higher efficacy

39:58 alert okay so in this case there's a you know AT&T internet ISP um that was core

40:08 leaving okay lastly um I just want to say we have introduced a new M Edge it's the X6 100 Giga throughput uh for 1025

40:16 gig ports um and uh this will be the backbone of many of our campus deployments uh coming

40:23 up I have a couple questions from online uh first was does redundancy

40:29 option care about switch and switch stack members yes so I didn't show it um but if if you look closely on the on the

40:36 um on the map some of the switches actually had S1 and S2 those are switches and stacks Member One member

40:42 two okay and any uh idea of when the RF spectrums y second half of this

40:50 year got one online question Al uh does the XO radio do both spectrum and frame capturing simultaneously or sequ

40:59 sequentially okay uh one last thing uh let's talk about some H stuff how about

41:05 that with mist so previously on Juniper and hamina we've done a lot of Integrations uh you can Auto deploy

41:11 directly from hamina to Juniper uh many don't know this but actually you know ham can automatically create the sites

41:18 deploy the aps you can also import from juniper back to Hina things of that

41:23 nature it's pretty amazing it uses like a billion API calls uh so that's already

41:30 there today and this is what we're going to talk about is a Q2 announcement

41:36 actually Mist has started to deploy these API changes already and we will release the product till during Q2 so

41:42 this is more on the day two and Beyond kind of kind of kind of a scenario more specifically

41:47 troubleshooting if we look at troubleshooting it could be a hairy issue where um you know different levels

41:53 of network Engineers are involved and different things are made at different times and the issue kind of gets

42:00 escalated uh you know to more and more of an expert person and it can be pretty hairy and then on the other side uh

42:07 there's an increasing amount we've heard about this today where uh you know the dream scenario where Marv soles the

42:13 ticket and case is closed and and you know it administrator can can just kick back and relax all right so usually it's

42:21 somewhere in between or or often it's somewhere in between okay but the challenge is this is the first first

42:27 time anyone looks at RF is when you do a truck roll right and you you actually get a visibility on the RF and and a

42:34 visual like map representation so we thought we would add live RF analysis earlier up the

42:42 stack and so let's take an example like picture an office with some Wi-Fi

42:47 problems all right uh there might be like a highspeed roaming problem there's there's an executive CEO running around

42:54 the office with I don't know apparently like what a wireless and a wired headset uh and he's he's having some roaming

43:01 problems maybe it's somebody like prepping for a board meeting he's actually to effective he's using two

43:06 laptops apparently uh but but beside the point like in the staircase there's a coverage problem okay so there's a

43:13 roaming problem staircase coverage and also like in the out Fring Fringe areas of the offices like uh people people are

43:20 you know are used to using internet for important things and it just doesn't work so let's look at how to visualize

43:28 that uh actually from a live Network and this comes through the integration all

43:33 right so the challenge here is when we looked at the simulation okay uh when we

43:39 designed the network everything was working great you know we placed the aps where they're supposed to go and everything is all good and green all

43:47 right when we did the S survey everything was good and green so so so

43:52 you know uh these bathroom areas where the Selfies are are being taken no the import work has been done uh you know

43:58 all all green but then in the live situation actually it's not that great

44:05 what just happened how did we get to live here so we we tapped into the M

44:11 infrastructure we pull in all the data we can RF data Channel channels Channel

44:17 widths everything about the M network using the API all the user needs to do is put the API key in once and he gets a

44:24 live view of the network all right so coverage seems to be low here let's look

44:30 at secondary coverage maybe we can find the holes because this was the problematic Yep this was the problematic area for the for the roaming CEO so

44:37 there's definitely problems there again live data with a current up to this second settings okay this is not how it

44:44 was simulated not how it was surveyed all coming through the m apis so so

44:51 these kind of problems I actually discovered the problem I do know personally the guy who who was test in

44:57 on the side and left the power to manual and and to minimal setting okay so so this was this was just a typical like

45:04 you know human error transmit po Snapple and this may have been preceded by a coverage hold detection event from

45:10 Marvis so so it's kind of like Marvis action comes in if you want to take a closer look you investigate it in hamina

45:17 so is this using the is this quick question is this using the beam uh

45:22 density map or map and stuff this is using M RM data okay yep yep yep and um

45:29 so so okay that was the misconfiguration and you know easy problem fix the RF level stuff like that what about the guy

45:34 in the stair case remember uh so so what this obviously isn't a configuration

45:39 problem it's an AP placement problem what we can do is just from the live view we copy and paste the aps to the

45:45 simulation and let let's look at primary coverage okay so so now we've kind of pasted the exact live situation into our

45:53 simulation and how do we fix it well this is an obvious case right just plays an AP but you can copy your current

46:00 situation and do changes uh you know you using just

46:05 that now okay your your next question is like okay you have full stack huming

46:12 experience here and and you've uh you know you've put in all the walls and kind of did the network plan and survey

46:18 and stuff like that do do I really need all of that do I need the surveys do I need the walls do do I need everything

46:25 for this to work and the answer today is no you do not and this is the new thing

46:30 uh like we we're announcing today and that West deployed actually last week so we're deploying also and uh West is

46:38 deploying AP toap mapping so using the RRM data all the aps can hear all the

46:43 aps so we're getting also those STS into hamina as well and with all the new data

46:49 that Wes is collecting we can now do environment learning automatically so you do not on an existing site if you

46:57 want to see accurately the RF or simulate changes you do not need the walls all you need to do is open Hina

47:04 click import to hamina and and there you go so let me take a site that has

47:09 absolutely no walls nothing like that check this out so usually if you have no

47:15 walls you have nothing you get this like you know uh completely circular coverage pattern I don't know if you can see this

47:21 variable live over Zoom but and and here's like offices and staircases so that's where the signal at and as I move

47:28 the AP you can see it's it's anything but circular because it has learned the

47:33 environment okay and if we move the AP to an open space the coverage area is

47:38 much much larger uh so so so take the all the M data do some prediction math

47:45 and learn the environment you don't every time need the walls to see accurate feat Maps so that's kind of

47:51 some some of the new stuff we're bringing the live view and also Dynamic environment learning

47:58 okay you see that is awesome thank you uh that would be use case like an

48:03 augmentation of an existing site yep yep yep the the live view you can use of

48:09 course for anything primary use case is troubleshooting but the environment learning is you know you know augment

48:15 any site and there you go also more accurate RF trouble shooting for coverage interference secondary coverage

48:21 everything